Hey, everyone. “Moriarty” here with some Rumblings From The Lab.
God bless Vern. He’s proof positive that anyone can turn their life around if they try. For those of you who haven’t enjoyed his writing here or on his own website, Vern’s a former convict who has channeled his post-prison energy into writing movie reviews. He loves bad-ass films, but he’ll write about the most surprising stuff sometimes. In the last few days, he’s sent me two great reviews, so I decided to run them together. I’d agree with him on one, but not the other, and I’ll let you figure out which one I mean. Vern… take it away.
Harry, I guess I don’t read your sight closely enough. I never heard of this picture other than it was playing the seattle international film festival and some people said it was good. I didn’t know what it was about but I remembered the title so I pulled it out of a box of garbage like wishmaster 3 and children of the living dead. This was a box of artisan entertainment’s straight to video garbage that not even my video store connection was going to consider watching. They were just gonna dump em off to charity.
So this is the story of the teen horror picture that almost got away. The one that played a couple film festivals and then got dumped straight to video in the US by Artisan Entertainment, due October 23. I mean you can understand with all the high quality pictures showing this summer there’s really no room to put another really good one out there. What good is another good movie. They are so abundant right now what really is the point, right? Can’t think of more than one or two good ones off hand, but I’m sure I’m forgetting something.
GINGER SNAPS is not a movie about cookies. It’s GINGER SNAPS as in THE SNAPPING OF GINGER or GINGER FINALLY SNAPS or THE STORY OF GINGER ACTUALLY SNAPPING. This is a horror picture for the strong independent women. That doesn’t mean it’s for pussies, ’cause it’s gorey and intense.
Ginger and Bridget are sisters, age 15 and 16, who have no friends but each other. They stand on the sidelines during gym class, hiding in their hooded sweatshirts. They made a suicide pact when they were younger and they fulfill it by doing a photo essay for school where they stage spectacular suicides. Also did you know dogs keep getting killed in the neighborhood? They keep getting mauled and I don’t want to give anything away but I’m guessing it’s by the werewolf that bites Ginger in the beginning and by the way this is the story of Ginger slowly transforming into a werewolf and how her little sister tries to be there to support her.
The director of this picture is a man, but this isn’t one of those teen-girl pictures where you can’t help but think the Writer was jerkin off the whole time. Alot of men directors wouldn’t’ve made Ginger and Bridget sisters. the chasing amy dude for example woulda definitely made them lesbians, and made ’em alot cuter. To avoid that kind of crap this director went out and got an actual woman to Write the script.
In one of horror’s greatest traditions the filmatists here use the supernatural to deal with real life problems that people can relate to, and in this case teenage girls. This is a movie about werewolves eating people and dogs but it’s also a movie about menstruation, and fuckin for the first time, and being jealous when your sister starts dating or hanging out with different people. Not as much jealous that she has those friends as that she’s being taken away from you. And it’s about girls not wanting to talk to their moms no matter how understanding their moms are, and about the intensity of emotions that you get at that age that make you just want to whoop somebody’s ass and/or bury them in your backyard. Or eat a dog I guess, I don’t know if that’s something kids do now or if it’s just a werewolf thing. I’m gettin old so who knows.
I gotta say, Artisan, you really blew it by not releasing this in theaters. If garbage like THE CRAFT can get a following of smart young girls then I guaran fucking tee you this one will be treasured for years to come. It’s gonna take longer to catch on thanks to you boys fuckin up but once the word spreads they’ll go nuts over it like they do with HEATHERS and HEAVENLY CREATURES. Guys won’t be able to relate as much on a literal level but I liked it so I’m sure you can find something to compare it to. Ain’t It Cool Newsies, you can compare it to if your friend starts reading only DC Comics, even though you grew up reading only Marvel together. Or whatever you nerds can relate to, I don’t know.
Something odd about this picture. It’s canadian. So they pronounce “sorry” wrong and the kids practice hockey out in the street, instead of real sports. And Ginger calls Bridget “B” for short which is corny by america’s more stringent cultural standards. But otherwise you wouldn’t know. I thought David “Davey C” Cronenberg and Atom “The Bomb” Egoyan were the only known canadians to make good Cinema, but the individuals who made this picture certainly know their shit.
Canada is always supposed to be a couple years behind the US so maybe that helped out here, because they’ve avoided the trend of trying to make their horror funny and self-referential. There’s not a single horror movie reference here unless you count when the drug dealer holds a syringe in his mouth which reminded me of the opening scene of George Romero’s MARTIN. Instead the filmatists just concentrate on creating a gloomy atmosphere and characters and relationships that are believable. People will especially relate to Bridget because she is smart and cynical without fitting a stereotype. She does not look like a product of Hollywood (or whatever they have in Canada.)
Seriously, don’t skip this one just ’cause it’s straight to video. I know what I’m talking about. As an outlaw film Writer, excluded from the critical mainstream and even rejected by the Online Film Critics Society (!), I’ve started reviewing alot of straight to video crap. If you thought you had it bad trying to find a decent movie in a THEATER, just try this stunt.
I’m not stupid, I know the rules. The main one is to avoid any straight to video picture with a rapper in it. I got nothing against rappers acting on the big screen, unless they’re doing an unneccessary remake of a classic (and I’m not talking about M you doofuses, I’m talking about DOLEMITE). But straight to video is different so I avoid Ice-T, I avoid Coolio, I even count Mario Van Peebles as a rapper due to his appearance in the film RAPPIN’. Even taking these precautions I have ended up sitting through some real doozies. THE CROW PART 3. CRUEL INTENTIONS PART 2. I’ve seen REPLICANT (Ringo Lam’s Jean Claude Van Damme clone picture) and MIMIC 2 (which is a sequel to MIMIC 1, would be my guess) and SOUTH OF HEAVEN, WEST OF HELL which is directed by Dwight Yoakam and stars Billy Bob Thornton, Bridget Fonda, Vince Vaughn, Pee-wee Herman and etc. but is only a little less boring than FINAL FANTASY.
So I know of what the fuck I speak. This is the first one besides ED GEIN that was really worth seeking out. ED GEIN is good for a straight to video but GINGER SNAPS is good period.
Originally posted at Aint-It-Cool-News: http://www.aintitcool.com/node/9809
View the archived Ain’t-It-Cool-News Talkback
Aug. 9, 2001, 2:16 a.m. CST
That backstage thing did make me think of Pee Wee. Maybe that was the intent. Regardless, J&SBSB should be pretty not bad… as for the other, uh, film… I’ll catch it on Cinemax next year or something. HooHah.
Aug. 9, 2001, 2:17 a.m. CST
Vern’s nuts. Gotta love the guy for being honestly nuts in this world we live in. And take note, I ruined it for the “FIRST!!!” assholes. You’re welcome.
Aug. 9, 2001, 2:24 a.m. CST
On second thought….
Vern isn’t nuts at all. In fact, that second review was probably the most sensible, helpful and TRUTHFUL review I’ve read in weeks. Damn, though, bet ya that Smith-worshippers are going to blow snot all over this TB in his defense. And with that, I will stop annoying multiple posting and not touch this TB again unles spoken to. Sorry, TBers, it’s been a long day and sometimes my thoughts come in sad little bunches.
Aug. 9, 2001, 3 a.m. CST
Bad movies and Ginger snaps
It’s always a joy to read about all the bad movies you are enduring on your side of the pond, knowing that they are coming to ruin my trips to the cinema for the next few months. However I did get to enjoy Ginger snaps during it’s limited run at a handful of cinemas over here. Does it piss me off that a film this entertaining and intelligent gets seen by a handful of people at a few art house cinemas while utter rubbish clogs up my local multiplex, damn right it does, but at least they made it and at least I got to watch it.
Aug. 9, 2001, 4:02 a.m. CST
Emperors New Parody
You know, I realised something the other day.
I was looking at my movie collection, and saw Clerks, Mallrats & Chasing Amy. Nice Kevin Smith collection, because he’s such a genius and his writing is so cool. Right?
Then I caught Dogma on cable for the first time since I really enjoyed it at the cinema.
And you know what?
It was bad. Embarrassingly bad. Awful, half assed, clunky bad.
So, I got to thinking about Clerks,the movie that I really feel in love with, which spoke to me personally and is still a favourite film of mine because it’s so personal, clever and real zeitgeist movie making of the time.
Basically Kevin Smith really pulled the wool over my eyes with that picture.
I loved it so much that my subconscious has since reasoned “hey it’s a Kevin Smith movie, you’re going to love it.”
So I’ve sat through Mallrats & Chasing Amy and Dogma (the first time), with a strained smile on my face, squeezing out laughs and thinking “hey this is great…? The mans a genius…?”
Now I finally have to own up to myself.
Clerks… Top movie!
Mallrats… 6th form school play.
Chasing Amy… Irritatingly, insultingly naieve.
Dogma… Fucking terrible.
I’ve done it. I’m free. I wont be seeing the new one in a hurry.
Self reverential fan-boy post modernism does not a movie make.
Aug. 9, 2001, 4:39 a.m. CST
So, tell us what you really think about it!
by Lance Rock
Aug. 9, 2001, 5:18 a.m. CST
Vern, relax yourself.
Hey, first time poster long time reader.
Aren’t you forgetting one thing? This is supposed to be a fun movie, everyone knows it’s a big joke, people that go to the movie aren’t looking to write a big review on here, they’re looking to kill some time.
Not every movie has to have a point, or have some meaning of life that you have to walk out of the theatre and go “Wow, I should be a priest!”
Are you one of the guys that saw “Dude where’s my car” came out all mad because you wasted your money? Didn’t you see it coming with a title like “Dude where
Aug. 9, 2001, 5:24 a.m. CST
What the hell is…
a filmatist? or scientifical? Get a damn dictionary dude and stop wasting our time with your half-assed, unintelligent rants. Make a movie on par with anything Smith has done and I’ll see that you have a valid opinion…otherwise, take your 1791 words and compress it to around 10… “I hated the film because I thought it was stupid.” … What was Vern in _prison_ for again??
Aug. 9, 2001, 5:33 a.m. CST
Vern: Cultural Entrepreneur
Judging my your first review, I think it’s fair to assume that you’ve never left your double-wide trailer, let alone the state you live in…..and for that, I’m thankful.
Aug. 9, 2001, 5:40 a.m. CST
Also, in Canada, They Wear Hats on Their Feet, and Hamburgers Ea
Jeeeeez. Maybe you haven’t heard, but Canada is on the greater North American landmass too. We get all the same TV shows and movies (unlike other countries, the same day they open in the states) and music, to the point where we barely have a culture of our own. It’s not like we’re sitting around saying, “Hollywood? What’s that? No, the center of the film industry is Sudbury!” Also, Mimi Rogers, an American, is one of the stars of Ginger Snaps. But for crying out loud, all the Canadians went to see The Mummy Returns and Rush Hour 2 this summer. We’re just as ignorant of Ginger Snaps as you Americans. I’m pretty sure that “America’s more stringent cultural standards” was a joke, but still. Also, why don’t more Americans like hockey? Why isn’t it a “real sport”? There’s just as much violence and last-minute action as football. That what you Americans like, right?
Aug. 9, 2001, 6 a.m. CST
Hey Vern, here in Canada we’re getting ” Halloween” released on
What an idiot this guy is. As another poster mentioned Canada gets movies on the exact same day as they are released in the U.S In fact here in toronto we get a lot of films before the majority of U.S cities do (aside from L.A and New York) And what’s the big deal about pronouncing words differently? In the good ole’ U.S of A people pronounce words differently in the South, midwest, northeast etc. Ignorant American.
Aug. 9, 2001, 6 a.m. CST
Damn, I’m impressed this review was allowed on. Can anyone tell me what filmmaker (rightly) charged that Smith has lowered the standards? I’d love to know . . .
Aug. 9, 2001, 6:05 a.m. CST
Aug. 9, 2001, 6:06 a.m. CST
What a Stupid Review!!
Who is this guy??
Why would such a great site with great and smart people give an idiot like Vern a place to give his dumbass reviews??
I mean he didn’t once know the name of the director of Jay and Silent Bob Strikes Back!! calling him Kerwin or Kelvin?? Is that supposed to be funny? It’s not. Saying Canada is years behind the US? Give me a break jerk.
I respect anyones smart reviews if they like or don’t like something and try to be funny about it but this guy Vern is just a jerk and shouldn’t be on this great site.
Here’s my 2 cents you don’t like it too bad!
Aug. 9, 2001, 6:13 a.m. CST
Kevin Smith movies make people laugh. Maybe it’s the fact that it’s not nearly as ‘funny’ as some of it is ‘shocking,or grotesque.’ But what makes his movies different is that he always interjects SOME intelligence, provokes some thought and, yes, makes you laugh with silky smooth dialogue rants. I’m sorry, I don’t laugh enough as it is. So Vern, sounds like you and the chain gang should aviod Osmosis Jones this weekend as well. Beware…I heard it is a ‘fun-gross’ movie. Ya know what I mean. (sorry)
Aug. 9, 2001, 6:19 a.m. CST
I’ve watched clips of Clerks, read the screenplay for Dogma, and just did not see the fanboy attraction to Kevin Smith. Some of the stuff in Clerks was kind of interesting, but it wasn’t really fully developed; as if a decent idea was enough to substitute for real craft. Nope. So when I read the screaming delight over the trailers for Jay and Silent Bob, I took a look. I got precisely one chuckle and lots of grimaces. Not only is Ben Affleck saying that Miramax will probably get Allfeck and Damon, etc. a bad idea, but it’s a badly-written bad idea. So it’s nice to see someone finally call this stuff for what it is.
Aug. 9, 2001, 6:29 a.m. CST
McFrenzy give us a shout
Vern superb work sir, speaking of lunatics where’s McFrenzy???
Aug. 9, 2001, 6:31 a.m. CST
Pronounced “Sorry” Wrong ?!??!
First of all…just because something is pronounced differently doesn’t mean it’s “wrong”. Secondly – HUH?!?! uh, what the heck are you talking about? or should I say aboot? (that seems to be the running Canadian gag…although no one says it and I myself just laugh that most Americans take it as the truth) I’m Canadian and haven’t once noticed a difference between the pronounciation of “sorry” – Sorry is Sorry, how many different ways are there to say it? Oh And “B” (short for Bridget) being too corny by American Standards? Um…just to point out one fanboy connection – Faith (Eliza Dushku) calls Buffy “B” on the popular “American” show Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Is Faith’s character somehow Canadian? I doubt it. Anyways, I saw Ginger Snaps the first weekend it came out…damn fine film. Oh and Ginger (Katharine Isabelle) just shows up on that godawful show “The Immortal” with Lorenzo Lamas!
Aug. 9, 2001, 7:05 a.m. CST
libby joe bob gelman waxler-briggs
by capt jack aubrey
jeez…i guess satire does close on saturdays ’round these parts, huh? was it only 10-15 years ago that paul rudnick and john bloom could swagger and swish through our lives with glee? has the immediacy of the internet rendered everything literal? like joe bob briggs and libby gelman-waxner, vern seems to be a bit of a put-on, or at least a jacked-up exaggeration…i’m not saying this review or writing is on the same level as rudnick and bloom (and most would argue that even their level is nothing too lofty…somewhere terry southern spins…), but to attack him as a buffoon or as silly is to sort of, um, miss the point…and even though i’m growing to love kelvin or kerwin smith and am looking forward to JSBSB, i agree that vern does have a valid point…see, son, it’s, i say, it’s a joke, son, a funny, a gag…
Aug. 9, 2001, 7:32 a.m. CST
All that rape in prison must have ruined you sense of humor Vern
I haven’t seen J&SBSB yet but Kevin Smith is one funny bastard. Putting Jason Mewes and Jeff Anderson (Jay and Randal Graves) on the screen, and giving them some of the funniest and most outrageous lines in the history of film is not an easy thing to do. I’m sure this film is very funny. All the reviews I’ve seen say it is funny as hell. I just think you don’t get it Vern. I am curious (seriously) to know what movies you do find funny.
Aug. 9, 2001, 7:40 a.m. CST
Vern, you rock!
Someone send that review to Kevin Smith. Finally someone tells it like it is!
Aug. 9, 2001, 8:03 a.m. CST
Keep your Alexandra DuMcSweeney & John HakkenBecker, Vern is sim
The most thorough, the funniest, the most insightful. If you think Vern’s “an idiot,” you’re an idiot, and probably a snob. BITCHES… LEAVE!
Aug. 9, 2001, 8:05 a.m. CST
“America’s more stringent cultural standards” ?
Ahahahhahahahhahahhaaaa….whoohahahahhahh hahahha ahahahh hahahhahhahah….. Ha… Ahhhhahahahahahahaha…..
Ah hahahhahah hahhah haah ahah ahha ha ha ha…….. I think I’m done now.
The man has a point – he can call Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back unfunny, because this guy is the comedy genius of our generation. I don’t care – let’s face it I’m only going to watch Eliza Dushku and friends in tight leather catsuits.
By the way, caught Ginger Snaps in it’s limited theatrical release here in the UK – it’s pretty good. Certainly better than anything else out last month. Shame on your distributors for making it STV in the USA. Not too sure about the ending, but otherwise very slick.
“Stringent cultural standards” That’ll keep me going all week.
Aug. 9, 2001, 8:45 a.m. CST
Vern, Vern, Vern
To bad you ruined what could of been a great review of the movie Ginger Snaps by displaying your complete ingnorance of Canada.
We do play organized “real” sports up here, we pronounce “sorry” differently not wrong. Canada is host to a whole lot of US televised shows and movie productions. That is the reason we are called Hollywood North. We are not 2 years behind in anything. I deal with many people from the US on a daily basis and for the most part they are educated and somewhat wordly. That is why I can’t help but point out your complete ignorance. Like I said, you took what was looking like an intelligent, edgy review and turned it into some ignorant drival.
Aug. 9, 2001, 8:50 a.m. CST
Lord help me it hurts.
Oh. God. OH GOD! Oh MY GOD. It hurts so much to read what the responses of many of you TBers. Here’s a hint. Read Vern’s review again but this time, take the “Kevin Smith fan-boy, I’m culturally enlightened, or it’s just a movie” blinders off. I will lay odds that if Mr. Smith himself read Vern’s review, that he would get an embarrassed kick out of it. I like Kevin Smith. I caught him when he showed up on Dennis Miller Live. He seems quite intelligent and has a great sense of humour. The man picketed his own flick for Christ’s sake. So, what many of you tber’s fail to realize. Vern’s on the money with his review. Granted I haven’t seen J&SBSB. But I will when it’s released here in Toronto regardless of Vern’s criticism. But that doesn’t mean I can’t see what he is trying to lay down for us. Comic book, film and TV cultured referential pap and parody is what passes for pure pleasure these days. It made Kevin Smith an industry favorite and as another astute TBer stated, he has pulled the wool over our eyes by twisting our perceptions on what to expect from a movie. But remember, twist too much and you’ll snap. As a pleasant segue, Ginger Snaps seems to be getting some fantastic reviews too. Guess it’s time to put this on the “must see” list. Also, as a Canadian, I’d like to chime in and say, I have a sense of humour about myself and my Country, so thankfully, I’m able to get Vern’s jokes about us too. And Vern, if you weren’t joking, then fuck you and John Wayne’s horse you rode in on.
Aug. 9, 2001, 9:04 a.m. CST
Vern, you kill me
by otis von zipper
Didn’t read all of the Ginger Snaps review, cause I want to see it without the knowledge. But, your review of Jay & Bob was killing me. I’ve been saying it for years that these “parodies” aren’t clever or really that funny and totally depend on having seen the original material. Think of Airplane. They parodied the disater movies in general without making specific refernces to certain movie moments and it was very very very funny. Basically, if you had seen 1 disaster flick, you could get the jokes. Now we have Scary Movie where they parody a Nike commercial (???) by simply copying it but having people act stupid and that’s suppose to be funny????? I don’t get it. I love to laugh, but this stupid shit just ain’t funny. I may still see Jay & Bob, because I did really enjoy Clerks, but you point is very valid, and I find it sorry that most people don’t understand that.
Aug. 9, 2001, 9:13 a.m. CST
Here’s my *coughjealous* rant….er movie review
by SilentBob X
Was this a movie review? Sounds like jealous posturing to me. Vern, if all you were going to do was shit all over the legacy of
Kevin Smith, at least have the decency to acknowledge that, instead of disguising it as a movie review. And, did it ever occur to you that this was Kevin’s
LAST ViewAskewniverse film?? So,
you don’t have to worry anymore
about big bad Kevin Smith bothering you anymore. Fuck, I
thought movie reviews were supposed to OBJECTIVE. Snootch to the Nootch.
Aug. 9, 2001, 9:15 a.m. CST
Talkbackers could learn from this guy
here is a guy who is being honest, but is also saying “hey, if you like this, then so be it” – he is stating HIS opinion and letting others have theirs. For fuck sake, there are talkbackers here who are wondering why they should even bother reading a review from this guy – tell ya what fucko – nobody wants to read your fucking crap either – here are some of my favorites (MY COMMENTS IN CAPS) – From: mtoppi
Subject: IS THIS A REAL REVIEW???
Comment: Is this guy for real? I don’t get it. I’m not impressed by every asshole’s review of a picture I want to see. Can’t you guys start up a policy that if you’re a nobody and you’re not funny and you want to review a movie you have to keep it short, sweet, and to the point??? HOW ABOUT A POLICY THAT IF YOU ARE A LITTLE BITCH THEN YOU DON’T GET TO POST IN THE TB?? ———-
Subject: Ya know what I mean, Vern…
Comment: Damn, sounds like you got nothing better to do with your time, Vern. I can’t believe you wasted so much space ripping someone for long time running jokes when you own name is a punch line for Jim Varny. You know what I mean, Vern. Pathetic. NO, PATHETIC IS SPENDING THE TIME TO MAKE A POST FOR THE SOLE PURPOSE OF RIPPING SOMEONE ELSE FOR THEIR OWN OPINION
————– From: kid_ego
Subject: What the hell is…
Comment: a filmatist? or scientifical? Get a damn dictionary dude and stop wasting our time with your half-assed, unintelligent rants. Make a movie on par with anything Smith has done and I’ll see that you have a valid opinion…otherwise, take your 1791 words and compress it to around 10… “I hated the film because I thought it was stupid.” … What was Vern in _prison_ for again??
——————- WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU TO JDGE SOMEONE’S OPINION AS “VALID”? GET OVER YOURSELF!!
Aug. 9, 2001, 9:24 a.m. CST
Snootch to the correctional facility
Isn’t it Smith’s “last” Jay and Silent Bob flick because Mewes is about to go to prison for a few years on a heroin charge? I’ll bet you a smelly XXL overcoat that when Jay gets paroled, there will be a sixth Jay and Silent Bob film “because the fans demanded it.”
Aug. 9, 2001, 9:32 a.m. CST
Blah, blah, blah
Vern, you’re cool as hell.
For you bitches gripping about Vern: get over yourselves. It would seem evident to me that he is kidding about the Canada and young people jabs.
I’ve liked or loved every movie Kevin Smith has done so far, and that means: I’ll be in line come opening weekend. What that doesn’t mean is: I have to blindly assume I’ll like ‘Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back’ just because it’s Kevin Smith. And it doesn’t mean I have to scream at and denounce anyone who has, in fact, seen it and didn’t like it.
All that said, ‘Ginger Snaps’ sounds like an interesting movie. If I can find it, I think I’ll see it.
Aug. 9, 2001, 9:48 a.m. CST
Right on… Smith’s a jerk
Kevin Smith’s greatest accomplishment is nailing down the role that Ben Affleck can play (in “Chasing Amy”). His movies are so smug, it’s like he’s grabbin you by the collar and screaming “SEE HOW CLEVER I AM?!?!? CAN’T YOU SEE?!?!” And he has the nerve to bash folks like Tim Burton and P.T. Anderson? Didn’t he call “Magnolia” an abortion or something like that? Any given scene in that film contains more genuine passion and talent than Smith can even concieve of. And I don’t think “Magnolia” is a masterpiece, but man I’d rather see it ten times before I see another movie where Smith tries to prove how clever he can be noting how many movies made after 1977 he’s seen and how many comic books he’s read. Seeing films by filmmakers whose talent obviously surpasses his own in every way must make his brain twitch. And it makes him jealous, so he has to bash them. Smith might be reading this right now and wimpering and thinking “I know! I’ll make a Jay and Silent Bob sequel to get back at this guy!” Is he really bashing TALKBACKERS in his new movie?!?! Oy! How can someone so insecure get work?
Aug. 9, 2001, 10:07 a.m. CST
Those of you wo diss Kevin Smith are forgetting one thing
Kevin is not a guy who has devoted years of his life to learning his craft or who made filmmaking his life – rather, he made a small film for the pure enjoyment of it (Clerks), saw it take off and become a huge hit and now, he gets paid shitloads of money to make funny, but poorly directed films – he himself doesn;t think he can direct and wonders why he keeps getting money to do it – but here’s the thing – any of you would do the same thing. If someone came to me and said “here’s a million bucks, direct this film” I wouldn;t even ask what it was about. Smith is not pretentious about his work, he holds no illusions about its importance – he just makes films that he thinks are funny and gives it to the studio – its their job to see that it makes money. In a summer where we have been inundated with pre-fabricated crap, I would think that more people would appreciate Kevin Smith’s complete independence and rejection of notions of craft and technique. The bottom line is (and I got this straight from Kevin Smith when he was at the TO FIlm fest) that Kevin Smith doesn;t give a shit if you like his movies. If nobody saw his movies and he was no longer able to direct, he’d shrug his shoulders and move on to something else. That is why i respect him – he panders to no one and looks for approval from no one but himself.
Aug. 9, 2001, 10:13 a.m. CST
by The Zug
I’m so glad to read that somebody else hated Dogma. I thought it was one of the worst movies I’ve seen in the last ten years. Clerks was a funny nothing of a movie, Chasing Amy was tolerable only, and Dogma was horrid. I just couldn’t believe the good reviews it got. Whatever points Smith should get for bravery he loses in execution.
I do like his work on Green Arrow, though. I’d read his comics anytime.
Aug. 9, 2001, 10:16 a.m. CST
response to PKD’s previous post
I’m glad Smith acknowledges that he’s not that talented and all, that’s great. He’d have been spared my scorn if only he didn’t go out of his way to slam the P.T. Andersons and Tim Burtons of the world. Mr. Smith, you are out of their league, so stay within your bounds.
Aug. 9, 2001, 10:24 a.m. CST
i want my screener pass back(why j&sbsb sucks)
wow…its been a couple weeks since i saw jay and bob strike back and im so hoping smith releases the actual not so sucky version into theatres. i’m a rabid jersey trilogy smith fan, but even i was a bit stunned
by ho wkevin falls asleep at the wheel at this one half way through. this film is funny as shit til they go on their road trip, and even though ya dont see it really in the commercials, THIS FILM TURNS INTO SCARY MOVIE!
thats right, sub par zucker movie parodies and an endless concerto of gay sex jokes. they even take the little shred of dignity mark hamil has and stomps him to pieces. while i dont see why glaad was upset, i could see how aicn talkbackers will be upset…not so much cuz the whole film revolves around a *very* AICN ‘thread’, but because its an insult to even the most pleasable of smart indie fans.
Aug. 9, 2001, 11:09 a.m. CST
Vern is a dumb ass, check out his website “Supporting Bad Ass: R
Wow he really is a dumb ass. Bruce Willis is remembered for his Moonlighting comedy days? wtf?!?! Ray Park was in a Star Trek movie?!?! This guy needs to fuckin die.http://www.geocities.com/outlawvern/OutlawAwards.html
Case in point, check out the Ray Park thing. Jet Li for Karate? Christ I hope this guy fuckin dies… please someone put a 7.62×51 round in his fuckin head.
Aug. 9, 2001, 11:54 a.m. CST
SHAVE MY POODLE!!
Aug. 9, 2001, 12:02 p.m. CST
Mr. Smith goes to Hollywood.
Although I agree with vern that the use of pop culture references is way out of control, Kevin Smith is at least good at it. I am the same age as Kevin Smith and I think it reflects the television generation. We don’t go out and do things. We experience life through the idiot box and movies so that’s what we know. Kevin is just writing what he knows. Life in New Jersey seen through his television. It’s not pretty but it can pretty damn funny.
Aug. 9, 2001, 12:29 p.m. CST
“real sports” oh sweet mother of…
I’m racking my brain to figure out just how you pronounce sorry wrong. Was kind of a “sarry” sound? Oh and what the fuck did that have to do with the movie? How many people had a problem with Renton saying shite 349 times (or so) in Trainspotting? And I definitely have a problem with the hockey-bashing. Best sport ever! But oh well, I guess that’s just the “personal touch” that AICN reviews are supposed to contain. I’ll definitely be checking out GS if it ever shows up as a rental near me. As for J&SBSB if this guy doesn’t appreciate Kevin Smith’s work, fine. But I sure as hell am not going to take his opinion seriously.
Aug. 9, 2001, 12:33 p.m. CST
Where does an ex-con get off ranting on Kevin Smith?
I dont go to the movies to see little wimpy stories of some guy with lupus’ plight to climba galcier. i don’t go to the movies to watch julia roberts portray a secretary. i go to hear “pole smoker” references and star wars inuendos. The only tragedy of film today is that there are not any good spoofs lately. Leslie Nielson should be given Cesar-like powers over greenlighting films.
Kevin Smith aunz all your asses.
He’s the best thing since multi-angle DVD pr0n.
Pole Smokers, all of ya.
Aug. 9, 2001, 12:36 p.m. CST
by capt jack aubrey
<<I thought movie reviews were supposed to OBJECTIVE>> this response has always spun my head around when i’ve written reviews…how could any review possibly be “objective”? i always thought the whole point of a review was to see what someone thought of a work, whether or not they liked it and why or why not….the better critics will strive to be fair and openminded and to explain and support their opinions, but if a review contains no opinion, then what’s the point of it? we come to this site for two reasons: to get tidbits of news about upcoming projects and to hear what people think of finished or near-finished films (and to hear goofy stories about harry et al’s lives)… If I want objective i’ll read the cast and crew list on IMDB
Aug. 9, 2001, 12:41 p.m. CST
objective has nothing to do with it
the problem isnt objectivity, its that this throwaway from the big house has a problem with funney movies. Kevin Smith has teh funney. Leslie Neilson has teh funney. This Buckaroo BigHouse Bobby does not have teh funney
Aug. 9, 2001, 12:44 p.m. CST
So explain this to me…
Why can’t Kevin Smith rip on other directors? Because he is one? Because he is (self-admitedly) a poor director? WTF? He has no right to voice his opinions? Boo hoo, Kevin Smith doesn’t like your favorite director. SO WHAT. Why does anyone care what Smith’s opinion is anyway, especially if you don’t like him? ************* What I resent in Vern’s review is the overall undertone of “I don’t find this funny and neither should you”. Vern, I can live with you hating Smith’s films, why can’t you live with me liking them?
Aug. 9, 2001, 2:07 p.m. CST
That’s my Vern – kicking some serious ass and taking names
by maxwelll demon
Vern’s website was a refreshing steel-toed boot to the sternum after reading the obsequious “so-and-so is an auteur – an Auteur! I say” tongue-washings that appear around these parts these days. God I love the tantalizing potpouri of righteous blue-collar (if only simulated) indignation and criticism-that-leaves-scars that wafts off Vern’s writing. Make him a regular Harry – or I walk. Wonder how Kevvy-Wevvy is taking the bodyshots . . . Maybe he’ll fire off a red-flagged message (complete with knee-jerk “air-quotes”) on his ViewAscrew website to the lap-dog faithful. See ya tubby-bitch.
Aug. 9, 2001, 2:10 p.m. CST
Listen up you primitive screwheads
Obviously Vern is just a character devised by the people who put together that geocities website. Harry probably is perfectly aware of this and thinks that you will also be smart enough to figure it out. Harry you overestimate the intelligence of your readers. Are they doing a serious review, yes, but is Vern a real guy, NO. Get a clue.
Aug. 9, 2001, 2:33 p.m. CST
the thing about Kevin Smith….
Sure he has a right to express his opinions… I guess the other thing that irritates me is the influence Smith has had on so many young filmmakers. Thankfully his influence is declining a bit but for a while there was a whole genre of talky, crappy, anti-cinematic indie garbage being produced on the heels of “Clerks”. It was this commercialization of indie films where investors looked for cheap, rambling screenplays from young writers that they could shoot on three locations because they thought our generation would eat it up like we did “Clerks”. Kevin Smith, to me, is an anti-cinema demagogue. So it’s expecially revolting to see him blast more talented film makers… Anderson and Burton aren’t my favorite directors, BTW, but they aren’t crapping all over the art of cinema. And why would he be blasting other film makers if his supposed honesty about his own abilities were genuine? Maybe Smith was kidding about suing Burton (remember, the two also have a history with the “Superman Lives” project… I’m sure Smith is bitter about Burton tossing his script), but I perfectly understand (and beleive) Burton’s comment that he would never read something written by Smith.
Aug. 9, 2001, 3:34 p.m. CST
Canadiens do speak funny,just ask me, I used to live there.
When i went from New Yawk to Pickering Ontario, I was in culture shock. All the people, white black, west indian, whatever, all spoke in this scottish, irish, english, funny way.Come on who can’t think a whole society that Says the last letter of the alphabet as a word, is not a little off kilter.Zed? Is not the last letter of the alphabet. Any word with an “O” in it sounds like “OO”, as in ABOOT,instead of about.
Aug. 9, 2001, 3:47 p.m. CST
if you are offended…
…you are a moron.
The “Vern” fellow is nothing but an Andy Kaufman style gag. The jabs at Canadians and what-not are part of the joke. They want you to get mad so they can laugh at you. Although it is true that Kevin Smith is a piss poor directer.
Aug. 9, 2001, 5:16 p.m. CST
I don’t care who he is, God bless Vern!
I have to admit that, as an Independant filmmaker, I was *greatly* inspired by Kevin Smith. I mean, if he can be a successful filmmaker putting out the crap he does, hell, ANYONE CAN! Thanks Kalvin, you give me hope! God bless America! I
Aug. 9, 2001, 7:19 p.m. CST
BEGIN SARCASM:// Wait, you mean a movie called “Jay and Silent
*gasp*! Actually, to tell you all the truth, I didn’t read all of this idiots review. Why? Well, in so many words…”it sucked”. See? I can say something sucks without having to rant on for over 1000 words. PS: Make a movie before you review one. That way, I can respect what you say. It worked for me.
Aug. 9, 2001, 7:46 p.m. CST
Only in America
I’ve seen numerous references to Ignorant American, would you please simply refer to him as ignorant.
Aug. 9, 2001, 8:57 p.m. CST
DOGMA SUCKS, God, that was cathartic!!!
I almost did not even read this tb as I am soooo tired of the remarks from all the “I Love J&SB” or “I Love Kevin Smith” bumpersticker owners. NOTE: I DO want to see Clerks as almost everyone agrees it was good. Albumen and The Zug, I hope three isn’t a crowd in this instance!____Bee
Aug. 10, 2001, 12:29 a.m. CST
I like Vern. I like the above poster who “freed himself” from K
Smooth move on admitting KS has made but one good movie, CLERKS. Every independent film maker could learn a great deal from that one… including Kevin Smith! Have Vern come back often too. I like his style. By the way Vern, the problem with these “young fuckers” is they’re “young.” They’ll laugh at shit we got bored with eons ago. BRRRRRRRAP! Oops! Pardon my backfire, heh-heh. But I just love them 7-11 burritos!
Aug. 10, 2001, 12:42 a.m. CST
Vern responds to you talkback fuckers
Look, I tried to make it clear that the Kevin Smitts fans would enjoy this picture. The screening I was at wasn’t packed but the young folks in there obviously loved the shit out of the movie. As Mr. Smith would say, they sucked this movie’s cock like a bunch of buttfucking cocksucker polesmoking faggots and gays. Anyway, my review was not for you kids. It was for the adults who do not enjoy these Leslie Nielson type parody pictures. I agree that my piece could have been a little better had it been alot longer however I feel that most readers of this particular “internet” medium are not yet ready for the true power of pure film Writing. That is why three or four talkbackers said that instead of reading film essays, they just want to read somebody say “it sucks.” Anyway please just think of this particular work as a primal scream against the growing tide of empty pop culture references. It is time for postpostmodern, my friends. It is time to rebuild the fourth wall. This picture represents the zenith of the Scream/Dawson’s Creek/Kevin Smitts cycle of characters put on screen just to talk about what other characters did on screen before. I believe it will finally eat itself and that is something to celebrate. * * * As for the canadians and other foreigners offended by my ginger snaps comments. I truly apologize because I was just pulling your leg. I’m sure hockey is a real sport underneath all those pads. It just pains me to see little kids spending money on all those helmets and pads and sticks and skates when all americans need is one basketball and a rusty hoop with no net. Anyway if anybody has real sports it is the brits who have less pads than american football players. So hooray for brits. However your crime movies do leave something to be desired. * * * One last thing about that “don’t say something bad unless you’ve made a movie yourself” nonsense. I gotta call retarded bullshit on that action. If you went to a restaraunt and you found a tampon in your soup would you say, “Damn it, this shit tastes like tampons!”? Or would you say, “Well, I can’t really complain, I’ve never made this type of soup myself”? Movies were not made just for filmatists to share with each other. And we are allowed to have opinions about them, at least in the us and canada.
Aug. 10, 2001, 1:06 a.m. CST
I am stunned…
Nothing on Aint It Cool News has ever affected me as greatly as this article has. I’ve always been the guy who couldn’t stop quoting and praising Kevin Smith movies to his friends. I haven’t felt this way since I was in junior high, and I realized that knights who say “Ni” and cows being shot from catapults aren’t funny, they’re retarded. I am ashamed for laughing at Kevin Smith movies. I’ve put money in that guy’s pocket so I could hear Star Wars jokes a fourth grader could have thought up. I said I liked Dogma! What the fuck is wrong with me?! The Wayans brothers are idiots for trying to entertain us with poorly conceived gross-out sex jokes, but Kevin Smith’s corpse-sex and “37!” in Clerks is brilliant because of the “independant contractors” scene?! How could I be this blind? I’ve talked shit about anyone who laughed at the stoned bluescreen flying dog in “Half Baked”, but I thought Jay getting the game show contestants stoned in Mallrats was funny! I’m ashamed of myself…
Aug. 10, 2001, 5:50 a.m. CST
Thank you very much. There’s one review of the latest ViewAskew by Harry making perfectly clear WHY he thinks this movie is funny in spite of it being a dig at people such as us, whilst this one here does exactly what Kevin Smith is so pissed off about: ranting for the hell of it. I happen to like the idea that every film of Kevin’s more or less refers to the others, and yes, I also find it funny. Now I’m told I’m not allowed to find it funny and call myself an adult or serious film fan (because for that I have to watch Japanese pictures, please…)at the same time. I am seriously delighted. So now I know. NOT! (By the way, that was a reference, too, to Wayne’s World, and therefore, as I have just learned, it does not constitute a joke.)
I’m looking forward to seeing Smith’s latest low-brow self-referential and maybe even pseudo-witty film. Hope he does another one with Ben Affleck with wings… That’d be nice, too.
Aug. 10, 2001, 6:38 a.m. CST
I’m not gay
But I would gladly be Vern’s bitch in prison. You fucks have no more piss – Vern has taken it all out of you. What does he plan to do with all this piss? If I weren’t so fucked up on over the counter pain relievers, maybe I could theorize. I love Vern. I would wilt in his arms like a 40s gun moll.
Aug. 10, 2001, 6:43 a.m. CST
Vern is so original
Hey, did every one forget that most of Kevin Smith’s work is comedy. Comedy generally isn’t of the high brow variety (if some one can name some “high brow” comedies I’d appreciate it). Kevin Smith works with some low brow humor but also some intellectual concept interspersed throughout his work. Not many can work in some thought provoking ideas into their comedies without destroying them. Although Parker and Stone managed to do it in South Park and they (by the way, Vern) were the first on the Canadian assault. Try coming up with your own original ideas before accusing others of being unoriginal. Hell, I saw an episode of Arli$$ that pretty much bashed Canadians in the exact same method you did and I don’t consider Arli$$ to be a bastion of intellectual thought.
Aug. 10, 2001, 7:36 a.m. CST
Hey, don’t blame us because you watch fucking Arliss. And don’t blame us if you don’t know of any smart comedies – try watching more movies. Vern didn’t have a problem with Smith’s humor being lowbrow, he had a problem with it being tired as fuck. Why do Smith fans argue points that their opponents haven’t even made? You’re all on fucking autopilot.
Aug. 10, 2001, 8:04 a.m. CST
I agree with Vern on Smith yet I still think he’s an A-hole!
I’m certainly not a fan of Smith’s. I don’t get at all what people find so amusing about Jay and Silent Bob, but anyhow, Vern is still a jerk for insulting hockey, the best damn sport in the world! So what if people wear a lot of padding in hockey? It’s a violent sport. Guys have lost eyes in hockey and gotten their throats cut. There are some guys who even use their sticks as weapons. Hockey is truly a man’s sport. Just watch the playoffs just once to see why. It’s not like that boring “America’s National pasttime” of baseball to see what a woman’s sport is all about. Where guys can go on the 15 day DL for a freaking hangnail. Hockey rules!
Aug. 10, 2001, 9:09 a.m. CST
soylentphil should read closer
Maybe you should take your own advice about being on autopilot. I never complained about watching Arli$$ just noted that Vern was using material that had already been used before. Second, I asked for some high intelligence comedies and since you “watch so many movies” maybe you could have named a couple. Try not bashing on autopilot.
Aug. 10, 2001, 10:37 a.m. CST
Well, if you wanna nitpick
“soylentphil should read more closely” would have been a better phrase, but still incorrect. “Read more carefully” is probably what you meant. The bit about Arliss? That was me fucking with you. Intelligent comedies? “Patti Rocks”, “The Producers”, “Raising Arizona” (which gives you the double head spin of being a smart comedy about dumb people), “O Brother Where Art Thou”, “Broadcast News”, “Annie Hall”, “After Hours”. This could take a while, junior. And to reiterate, no one was pointing out that Smith’s films are somehow not intelligent. They were their smarts on their sleeves. They’re just not terribly original, at least not after five of the fucking things.
Aug. 10, 2001, 10:45 a.m. CST
High brow comedies
Just a few off the top of my head: The Birdcage (I think that’s right – with Robin Williams & Nathan Lane), Four Weddings & a Funeral (arguably), Dr. Strangelove, Any Peter Sellers movie for that matter. But comedy doesn’t have to be high brow to be good, it just has to be *funny*. Kevin Smith is not. He’s just doing the same tired jokes over and over again. – LF (This post better not get sent all the way up front to oblivion like my last one.)
Aug. 10, 2001, 4:32 p.m. CST
Vern’s review of Jay and Bob
by makin’ bacon
It doesn’t have to be brand new or intelligent to be considered funny. Just a note to those who think otherwise.
How many times did Lucy “have some ‘splainin’ to do. Is it especially smart, no. Is it original after the millionth time, no. But is it funny, you bet.
If Kevin Smith tried to pass off his movies as the brilliant works of a literary mastermind, I would agree with you but he doesn’t. In everything I’ve ever read about him he describes his movies as “a lot of dick and fart jokes” which they are.
Is Richard Pryor great? Damn straight. But if all you ever heard wad Richard Pryor material it’d get old. Comparing the two isn’t really fair. Both funny but in different ways
Kevin Smith makes movies for people with interests similar to his own and I for one quite enjoy them.
Aug. 10, 2001, 6:30 p.m. CST
WAS THE MOST INEPT PIECE OF CRAP EVER FILMED. What was he thinking?
Nov. 20, 2002, 3:15 p.m. CST
This Vern is such a baaad writer. And criticizing Kevin Smith’s writing style? Please. Smith could write a review 10x better than that. Oh…wait…